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Jickkay
Level 1: Cadet

Re: False missed calls every 36 minutes

Hi Ian,

I used your link and went to a Telstra chat line.  The contact seemed to think your answer was a crank call and that it didn't require technical support at a higher level.  After a lot of toing and frowing to get him to understand the problem he came to "his" solution - do a reset of the Telstra modem and monitor the phone for the next 24 hours. The chat cut out before I finished.

The end result is that I am still getting the false missed calls every 36 minutes but my wi-fi devices ceased to work.  I realised this happened because the technician that installed the new smart modem had worked hard to duplicate the name and password of the modem he replaced.  Luckily the reset name and password for the new modem are found on the side of the modem but I had to reset all wi-fi appliances in the house.

Not happy with Telstra at all.


@Iain_T wrote:

Hi Jickkay, 

 

Sorry to hear this is ongoing and it would be best to have our tech team check on this again here  https://tel.st/8rxsn and we can escalate this to another tech visit if needed. 


 

Support Team
Support Team

Re: False missed calls every 36 minutes

Hi @Jickkay,

 

As has been stated in the thread previously, if our Tech Support team are not able to resolve the issue with a reset of the modem, the next step will be to request a replacement modem. 

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Kezza44
Level 1: Cadet

Re: False missed calls every 36 minutes

I have the same issue started a few months ago after I received an email from telstra informing of an interruption/outage due to maintenance. It really erks me as phone lights up room when trying to sleep every 36minutes. Its not the phone as it does it on another set that is not nbn compatible. I am in Townsville. What ever Telstra has done during upgrade or maintenance they need to fix as its ruining my sleep and draining phone batteries 

Kerborous
Level 4: Private Eye
Accepted Solution

Re: False missed calls every 36 minutes

Well I have done some additional study in this perplexing problem...such is the curse of being an engineer.

 

What we know at the moment is that the Gen 2 GW when it sends the periodic (every 36 mins) message waiting status to the VTech phone which stimulates a missed call event.

 

1). My 1st thought that it was related to the line reversal signal being detected by the phone as a ring event. BUT no this is not the case since the diode bridge test would have suppressed the signal however the problem isnt fixed.

 

2). This leaves the FSK signal generated by the modem to stimulating a missed call.

 

The FSK signal use Visual Message Waiting Indication messages will be delivered using the Multiple Message Format

 

Simply put this can be ON/OFF - to tell the phone that there is a message in Telstra's message bank plus additional parameter like time/date - telling the phone when the message event occurred.

 

If the time/date data is suppressed then the  VTech phone doesnt increment the call counter. This can be seen on a CRO connected to the PSTN NW and noting the length the FSK signal. So the VTech phone is incorrectly using the time/date data to record a missed call event.

 

Work a rounds - disabling Telstra's VMWI service OR finding ta phone that complies with Multiple Message Format having a date / time signature.

 

Long Term fix Vtech - alters their design so that is time/date portion of the VMWI is supplied they dont count this a missed call.  

 

 

Support Team
Support Team

Re: False missed calls every 36 minutes

Nice work @Kerborous!

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Jickkay
Level 1: Cadet

Re: False missed calls every 36 minutes

KuborousH

Since your solution appears to lie with VTech phones, I contacted VTech and received the following reply:

We have found that customers on the NBN who have been supplied the Telstra Smart Modem may receive "Phantom Rings" and/or "Phantom Missed Calls" despite the fact the phone is not actually ringing to alert you to an incoming call.
Customers who have been using the Telstra Smart Modem and experiencing this issue, who after consulting back and forth between us and Telstra, decided to use a different modem (non Telstra Smart Modem) to test the issue and the problem with "Phantom Rings" and/or "Phantom Missed Calls" was eliminated.

Our conclusion from this is that it appears Telstra regularly "pings" the Smart Modem to see if it is still online or not. This "ping" results in a "Phantom Ring" and/or "Phantom Missed Call" on your VTech phone. From a phone perspective there is no setting that can be changed to ignore the "ping" - the phone simply responds to the signal it is being sent by the network or the equipment it is connected to.

In this situation we would advise that you speak to your NBN service provider to have them fix this issue.

Please note this does not appear to be an issue that is isolated to VTech phones. We have also had confirmation from other cordless phone brands that this same issue is also happening with their phones, and the common denominator appears to be the NBN service provided by Telstra.

Further to this, the issue only appears to have started when Telstra perform an upgrade to their NBN network/equipment, as customers who have been using our phones prior to this upgrade never experienced this issue.
If your service provider is unable to resolve the issue their service/equipment set-up is creating, all you can do is continually review and delete the Call List/Call Log. Obviously this is not an ideal scenario but until your service provider resolves this problem then this is the only course of action we can suggest.

 

Kerborous
Level 4: Private Eye

Re: False missed calls every 36 minutes

Hi Jickkay,

 

So the logic being applied by Vtech in their response to your inquiry seems to be centered on the following:

 

Phantom Rings in the VTech phone can be resolved by swapping from the Telstra Smart Modem to a non-Telstra Smart modem.

 

However this logic would be equally true if we consider swapping phones from vTech phone to say a Telstra T1000c rental phone or other phone which is exposed to the same "ping".

 

Therefore the logic is flawed as the idea of swapping doesn't yield a useful conclusion since modem swapping and phone swapping can make the issue come or disappear.

 

Ultimately the right way forward is to look at the protocol (signal) between the modem and phone to determine what the problem actually is and to make the corrective action.

 

So I would comment first on a phone's design for "ring recognition" which triggers the missed call counter.

 

1) Ring recognition is governed by the Australian Standards (S002) and it doesn't permit a phone to recognise ring from the VMWI FSK signal which is what is occuring (what VTech called ping). Instead S002 describes ring as recognising Vac signal. (you can see my earlier references in the thread to the S002 spec).

 

2) When a VMWI signal includes ON/OFF + Date and Time why would a VTech phone see this as a missed call? I could guess that the products incorrectly treat the on-Hook signal as a Caller ID signal which might trigger the missed call counter.

 

Moving forward there would be a few possibilities:

 

a) V-Tech could update the FW of the phone to stop counting VMWI signals having a time/date stamp from triggering a missed call.

b) Telstra could alter the GW FW to provide a work a round that suppress the time/date stamp to overcome the vTech issue.

c) Telstra turn off the message bank service .... not my favorite as this advises users when they have a message left in message bank service (voice mail).

d). Live with the problem but this would fly against the Engineer's code of ethics

 

K.

iamgroot9
Level 1: Cadet

Re: False missed calls every 36 minutes

Hi, sorry for the late comments.
I am having this issue as well. I have been in touch with Telstra, at one point they had me keep a 7-day 24-hour log of the calls as they were convinced it was nuisance calls. No hope of getting them to understand that it could not be that every day every 36 mins for 7 days ( more at the time) that it was a nuisance call. I also tried to explain to them that my MIL who lives in a completely different suburb from me,(approx 45 mins away) was having the same issues, as was the lodge my FIL belongs too. All fell on deaf ears. 
I've read thru some of the comments about this and I don't think this is just the v-tech phones as my inlaws don't have one...I'm so over it that I now ring the tech at least once a fortnight to ask them to fix it. As for the voicemail bit, I don't have that set up either. Possibly the worst thing about the smart modem was that it completely reset my email access and for nearly 10 days ( really hadn't noticed them missing) I was not receiving all my emails. This I only discovered when I tried to send an email and received a phone call from the recipient that it was all encoded!!!
I was not a happy camper.

The worse thing I ever did was put on the not so smart modem

 

X-C914939
Level 1: Cadet

Re: False missed calls every 36 minutes

Howdy Y'all, another 36min customer here, Just moved over to NBN HFC, still using same modem that was on my Copper ADSL2 connection and now I have the bug, 
Modem is G2 smart and Phones are V-Tech, I have CND & Messagebank on the service.
My problem is the same as PMG67 and others here, I have not reported it based on the fact that it's hilighted here and seems to be going around in circles, calling 132200 would just make it worse based on others posts who have been there and done that.
Another thing I have noticed since connection to NBN is that I quite frequently get internet screen messages that advise site cannot be reached. Anyone noticed this since moving over?
Seems like a coincidence that the 36 second calls and the internet messages started only when the NBN kicked in.
I would be interested to hear from others who may have the same issues here Smiley Happy

OnEdge14
Level 1: Cadet

Re: False missed calls every 36 minutes

Hi Kerborous,

This is my 1st post so bare with me.

I first had the issue of phantom missed calls every 36 minutes back in early May but called support for help late may, like one other user I was asked to log the calls for a month whilst they put a traces on my line (clearly that was never going to help).

I looked at the event log as the missed calls were showing up and noticed the same thing occurring in the log all the time.

I tried to get this detail to support by calling in again but they were not interested.

I was talking to a manager at Telstra a couple of weeks ago and he asked me to email him the details.

I did this and he managed to get my issue escalated.

They sent out a technician who upgraded my Gen1  to a version 2 Gen2 modem.

All seemed to be fine however I never had a green light on the front of the modem and when I set up my wireless network devices they could not connect to the internet.

So I rest the modem and the issue started to occur again.

I created a log aft the missed calls and recorded the relevant lines from the event log into an excel s/sheet, I then sent this to the Complex Complaint Case Manager assigned to resolve my issue.

She emailed back 2 days ago and said "Thank you for your email and I appreciate you sending the call logs."

"I have escalated the issue with technical team and they in turn have escalated to NBN. I will update you with the progress of it early next week."

Earlier this evening I received a phone call (not from the Complex Complaint Team) stating that the issue is neither Telstra nor the NBN but my particular phone.

Like Ginny 16 my phone is a Telstra V580a phone with an answering machine.

The support person said that technical support are still trying to resolve the issue with my phone. (I'm not going to hold my breath).

In you post you state;

"b) Telstra could alter the GW FW to provide a work a round that suppress the time/date stamp to overcome the vTech issue.

c) Telstra turn off the message bank service .... not my favorite as this advises users when they have a message left in message bank service (voice mail)."

 

Firstly, what is GW FW?

Secondly, I have long ago dialed #99# to disable my message bank (as I use the answering machine on my phone) Is that the same as getting Telstra to turn off the message bank service?

If not then maybe that will fix my issue!

 

 

 

OE14
LeighT
Level 3: Gumshoe

Re: False missed calls every 36 minutes

Hi all.

I am another customer with the same problem.  I have a Telstra NBN gateway (technicolor) and have been using three T502 cordless phones paired directly to the gateway as my home phone solution.  Annoyingly, a few months back (after the now-infamous firmware upgrade by Telstra to their modem) these handsets began dropping calls mid-way through conversations. 

 

Unable to stand it any longer, last week (30 Aug 2019) I bought a vTech 18151 pair of cordless handsets which pair with a base thingy that is supplied as part of this vTech NBN-ready offering.  This base thing plugs into one of the green 'phone' sockets on the modem (looks like a normal phone as far as the modem is concerned) and the handsets pair with that.  Well.....

 

Turns out I get lots of phantom missed calls on my new handsets, at 36 minute intervals, exactly as per the content of this thread.  No ring tone, just the flashing call light for a few seconds on each occasion. 

 

Based on this thread, it looks like nobody owns the problem (except the customer, of course).  On the basis of what I read here, it I am assuming the solution for me is to take the newly-purchased vetch product back to Harvey Norman for a refund.

 

Any other ideas to suggest otherwise????

HONEYONE2
Level 1: Cadet

Re: False missed calls every 36 minutes

This is the response I received from Vtech, seems they don't care about losing customers...

 

1) All VTech phones are approved by an accredited ACMA test lab, and manufactured to this approval, to meet all ACMA mandated standards for fixed line voice services

2) All NBN service providers should be delivering their services to these same ACMA standards

3) If any NBN equipment/service is causing phantom ringing/missed calls when there is no actual incoming call then the issue is with the NBN equipment/service. In this situation we can only advise the following:

a/ Persist with Telstra to find a resolution to this issue

b/ If you are seeking a refund on the product please return the product to the place of purchase along with your receipt and have the store contact us directly and we will issue them a return authority.

X-C914939
Level 1: Cadet

Re: False missed calls every 36 minutes

Hi Honey, I don't think it's a V-Tech issue as others with Telstra phones are having the same issue, NBN tech must be pinging the modem and that is registing as a call on yr display. I have given up and will know its been fixed when I no longer see it. The only reason I am not stomping my feet is that these calls do not trigger the ringer so I am unaware it is happening. I must say it is dissapointing that no one seems to be taking the fault seriously after nearly 3months of comments.

 

OnEdge14
Level 1: Cadet

Re: False missed calls every 36 minutes

Hi X-C914939, I finally got my issue fixed and it was as I expected - My fix (not Telstra).

I was asked to test another phone, so i had to borrow one and it had no issues (this one didn't have an answering machine like mine).

As this was now the solution I had to go out and buy the new phone that I wanted and was reimbursed $100 by Telstra.

I kept away from Telstra and V-Tech phones and purchased a Uniden XDECT 8355+2 system with answering machine and all the bells and whistles.

No issue now Smiley Happy

OE14
HONEYONE2
Level 1: Cadet

Re: False missed calls every 36 minutes

Vtech sent me another email....

 

"Whilst we continue our own analysis of a single piece of equipment, the Telstra Smart Modem, causing this problem, we can only provide support based on facts and currently these are as follows;

 

1) All of VTech's cordless telephones are tested against all of the required ACMA standards as they currently apply to the PSTN fixed line in Australia and pass these as required by law. We will not disclose our accredited test lab name to any member of the public. Their contractual obligation is to VTech and VTech alone.

 

2) When connected to an Australian PSTN connection, including Telstra's own PSTN fixed lines, this problem does not exist.

 

3) This issue only occurs with Telstra's Smart Modem which Telstra widely introduced as their NBN gateway solution. It does not occur with any other modem/gateway being used by hundreds of the other Australian NBN service providers. By using this modem in the configuration they have implemented - the FSK transmission set-up is obviously different to what they do on their PSTN fixed line service - Telstra has failed to re-create the PSTN fixed line environment consumers experienced prior to the implementation of the NBN so as consumer's existing equipment (cordless phones etc.) will continue to operate as they experienced on their PSTN connection. Interestingly some customers had their VTech phone and NBN service working perfectly with the Telstra Smart Modem, then Telstra made some firmware changes/upgrades and from this time on experienced the missed calls issue."

Kerborous
Level 4: Private Eye

Re: False missed calls every 36 minutes

@HONEYONE2 

 

What is interesting in VTECH's response is the reference to compliance against ACMA's requirements. IMHO the product should ONLY recognize a ring event solely from the detection of a valid ring signal which is Vac voltage signal defined in regulatory requirements of S002.

 

Telstra's message bank service uses a Vdc reversal followed by FSK signal (Yes or No message plus time stamp). It is the timestamp portion of the signal that VTECH's phone interprets as a ring event.

 

A test house that validates a phone against S002 will includes ring performance testing BUT not required to validate VMWI since it is not a regulatory requirement. So the testhouse report wont reveal the issue. 

 

S002 is publicly available and can be found at 

https://www.commsalliance.com.au/__data/assets/pdf_file/0006/1122/S002_2010.pdf

 

 

 

 

Regards

K.

gman74
Level 1: Cadet

Re: False missed calls every 36 minutes

@Kerborous 

The problem here is that this problem does NOT exist on Telstra's traditional PSTN with a MessageBank service but it DOES exist on their NBN service using the Telstra Smart Modem. So Telstra have obviously changed something in their MessageBank set-up on the NBN that's causing this issue for customers, including me, who's VTech phone worked perfectly previously. Not happy as I was guaranteed by Telstra that all of my existing equipment, including my VTech cordless phone, would work as it did before they installed the NBN and their modem.

iamgroot9
Level 1: Cadet

Re: False missed calls every 36 minutes

When we were sent the new modem (Gen 2)  we were not told that the phone needed to be "paired". which was one issue that had arisen, then the tech I spoke to wanted to know what phone we had (we have a VTech cordless system) and when I told him he said that it was possible that the phone would not be able to be paired....thankfully it worked tho we have had no end of issues since installing the modem.
I recently had to call as yet again my phone was not working, it just goes dead, the only blessing of the "ghost calls" is that I can tell how long my landline has been off. When speaking to the tech from the Platinum call centre I mentioned this forum and she had a quick look, she was a little shocked at the number of people talking about this issue with the phones, I was then contacted by another tech who informed me that "Telstra are aware of the ghost call issue and it is a problem with the Gen 2 modems and the individual customers phone system not being compatible". Apparently there is a firmware upgrade happening and it will just "fix" things.....yeah right!!! Tho the tech could not give me any indication as to when this would be occurring.

gman74
Level 1: Cadet

Re: False missed calls every 36 minutes

@iamgroot9 

Thanks for your info. Interesting that you have the problem with the VTech handsets paired to the modem whereas I have my VTech main base station connected to the phone port on the modem. Seems the problem occurs either way.

I can't believe Telstra's comment "Telstra are aware of the ghost call issue and it is a problem with the Gen 2 modems and the individual customers phone system not being compatible" - they moved me to the NBN and assured me I would have no compatibility problems with my existing phone as their NBN service would be identical to my old landline service - obviously it ain't and now they're trying to lay the blame at the door of phone manufacturers.

I guess I'll just have to wait for this mystery modem firmware upgrade to fix the issue. Very frustrated with Telstra on this but then again.....it seems to me Telstra just drag their feet in the hope you'll buy one of their compatible handsets. I'm sure there's some sort of law against this?

Kerborous
Level 4: Private Eye

Re: False missed calls every 36 minutes

When Australia decided to role out NBN and decommission PSTN this represented a big change in the voice service delivery for the nation.

 

Telcos needed to turn off there telephone exchange equipment and replace this with VoIP / SIP systems. This modernization didn't come without problems since "modems" like the GEN2 effectively replaced your local exchange and provides the telephone line connection into which existing / new phones connected to.

 

The manufacturers / designers used the Australian telecommunication "standards" to develop the suite of capability (main documents are AS S002 + AS S004). It is these standards that ensure a basic quality call is possible and govern ring. So a change introduced by a Telco to deliver voice via NBN or a change to launch a new DECT phone should be plug an play. I would anticipate that the "new GW FW" being discussed by in the thread will relate to a work a round  to overcome the VTech issue relating to the interpretation of the time stamp problem associated with voice message notification.

 

So in principle I would always rely on compliance with the key standards rather stating any change would be the source of an issue.

 

K. 

 

 

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